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Search 2008 Bills:

SB788: Social Services, Department of; nonattorney employees to complete, sign, file petitions & motions.

Chief Patron

Sen. Fred Quayle (R-13)

Fred Quayle (R-13)
Served: 1992–

Progress

Yes Introduced
Yes Passed Committee
Yes Passed House
Yes Passed Senate
Yes Signed by Governor
Yes Became Law

Status

04/11/2008: signed by governor

View Entire History

Summary

Department of Social Services; petitions.  Authorizes nonattorney employees of the Department of Social Services to complete, sign and file petitions in Department cases and provides that any orders entered prior to the effective date of this bill are not deemed void or voidable solely because the petitions and motions were signed by nonattorney employees.

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Video

Votes were cast on this bill on the following dates for which Richmond Sunlight has video: 01/22/2008, 01/22/2008, 01/24/2008, 01/24/2008, 02/05/2008, 02/06/2008, 02/06/2008, 02/07/2008, 02/07/2008, 02/08/2008, 02/08/2008, 02/13/2008, 02/13/2008, 02/15/2008, 02/15/2008, 02/29/2008, 03/06/2008 and 03/11/2008.

Comments

Marsha Maines writes:

THIS IS AN ATTEMPT TO COVER UP RICO ACTIONS COMMITTED BY THE ATTORNEY GENERAL.
DCSE HAS ILLEGALLY CLAIMED MILLIONS OF $$$ OF unverified debt to enable 'the state' to obtain Federal matching dollars. They charge interest on interest illegally and do not follow Fair Credit Lending Law either. The books are cooked and this legislation is an attempt to sweep it under the rug. "Knowledge will forever govern ignorance, and people who mean to be their own governors, must arm themselves with the power which knowledge gives." [James Madison]

Dave Briggman writes:

This is the Senate equivalent to House Bill 1382...while this Bill could act prospectively, should this legislation be passed and signed into law, I'll be in U.S. District Court the following day challenging the retroactive provisions, which are clearly a violation of the law.

John L. Bauserman, Jr., Esq. writes:

Kill this bill now, it cannot be fixed:

first, full disclosure: this issue arises in large measure out a case I litigated in Fairfax JDR Court. Also, Dave Briggman, who called this issue to my attention, is a former and current client of mine. That said, moving beyond the narrow interests of one client and one lawyer, kill this bill now, for the following reasons:

(1) It is a bad idea to empower rank and file social workers (DCSE support specialists, child protective services case workers, foster care workers, adult protective services workers, etc) with even more authority to file legal pleadings without even obtaining minimal attorney review. Does anyone really believe that, no matter how well intentioned such workers are, that they should be empowered and entrusted to make these kind of important legal judgements?

(2) There is eighty years of legal precedent in Virginia that stands for the proposition that non-attorneys cannot file legal causes of actions or pleadings, unless they are litigating their own case pro se. This would undo years of established precedent, and create (or validate) a MASSIVE exception. Where does it end?

(3) The legislation is clearly intended to be retroactive in effect and will impair substantive rights of tens of thousands of persons in virginia. I seriously doubt the implications of this have been fully considered. DCSE has grossly mismanaged its caseload by allowing tens of thousands of pleadings to be filed on non-attorney signatures. Where is the accountability?

(4) Do these hundreds of rank and file case workers understand that potential liability they will assume for signing pleadings, if there is a significant factual or legal error? They will be subjected to sanctions by the Court. Do they have the understanding, knowledge and background, much less the desire, to take on that liability? Who will defend them if the need arises?

(5) I make the assumption that the state bar membership has not weighed in on this issue. I predict a tremendously unfavorable response if the issue and implications are clearly laid out and discussed with family law/elder law and criminal defense attorneys statewide.

John L. Bauserman, Jr., Esq (Fairfax, virginia)

Ron Jag writes:

This bill if enacted will be a disaster for Virginia. Particularly our children. Social Workers and non-attorney employees of social services are not trained in the Law. They DO NOT HAVE THE KNOWLEDGE OR THE TRAINING to identify hersay from evidence.

These people are the "QUACKS OF THE LEGAL PROFESSION". If these people are allowed to file petitions and motions. - Then We might as well allow a scooter mechanics, the plumbers and the cab drivers to be officers of the court.

"Virginia is for Lawyering" not lovers.

Dave Briggman writes:

The retroactive provisions of this legislation and House Bill 1382 are illegal and unconstitutional. Further, why should we expect to rely on the judgment of non-attorney employees of DCSE, when the LAWYERS in the Attorney General's Office has been allowing this practice to go on for 20 years in violation of Virginia law? Further, attorneys in private practice, with less than a handful of exceptions, have never even inquired as to who was signing the motions in the first place.

Clearly, Bob McDonnell and his cronies, with respect to these two pieces of legislation, meet the dictionary definition of fascist by protecting the government from its own screwups over the rights of the individual.

Chuck K writes:

If you guys knew the system, this is already in our code. This bill just clarified it. It's a practice that already takes place but some dumbass judge cant read the law well enough to see that...hence this bill clarifying throughout the code so biased judges with moral standpoints such as yours will be inclined to actually look at the law before ruling on it.

Thanks and do your research.

Dave Briggman writes:

Really, Chuck? why not show us all where this practice is already codified? It isn't Chuck and merely stating that this "clarifies" present law doesn't make it so.

I would suggest you take a look at Jones v. DCSE, 19 Va.App. 184, 450 S.E.2d 172, 1994, where the Court of Appear ruled that non-attorney employees of DCSE can't even sign a Notice of Appeal without making it invalid.

Further, if you look at the Jones v. Jones case from the Court of Appeals of 2006, you might read where the court said that only two people can legally sign pleadings here in Virginia: pro se litigants and attorneys licensed to practice law.

If you are thinking that § 16.1-260(A)(ii) gives them that right, than you no zero about the law. This statute merely gives DCSE standing to enter cases. It omits any reference to non-attorney employees being allowed to sign pleadings. Neither does §08.01-271.1 and most importantly, § 16.1-88.03(B) specifically BARS non-attorney employees of ANY LEGAL ENTITY IN VIRGINIA from signing motions for show cause summons".

Thanks, I've done my research and sued the Commonwealth which is why Virginia has introduced this legislation.

Have you any response, Chucky?

Marsha Maines writes:

Chuck - EXACTLY 'which' code are you referring to?
..your snake oil claim there was ANY LAW on Virginia's books that permits someone who is "NOT" a licensed lawyer to practice law is the same bull our legislators just bought. Go ahead, Cite the Statute you claim 'already existed'
Want a taste of reality?
"On November 15, 2007, the Boston Office of the U.S. Marshal started serving the RICO complaint on the sixteen defendants. The message transmitted shortly thereafter to several media outlets reads: “Civil RICO Suit Names Thirteen Lawyers and Three Judges in Staged Litigation Scheme.”
EXPECT TO SEE THIS COMING ...Virginia has been involved in a MASSIVE scheme to defraud the tax paying public, the Federal Government and the State's own employees...all 875 of them eating over $35 MILLION in Salaries..where do you think the $$ has been coming from??? "efficient" and "legal" collection efforts like the Gov and AG claim? SHOW ME THE STATUTE YOU ARE REFERRING TO>>> I'll show you at least half a dozen proving you incorrect..

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Bill Text

Related Bills

  • HB1382
    Introduced: January 09, 2008
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  • SB387
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  • HB143
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  • HB172
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